Russell (![[info]](http://l-stat.livejournal.com/img/userinfo.gif){kind=small} kantol) wrote,@ 2004-06-19 23:22:00 |
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Linguistic interlude
Well, it's been a few days since I've written here. That's because I was on a class trip to Aichi Prefecture 愛知県 to visit a Toyota fatory and Exhibition Hall, see the Tokugawa Art Museum, and go to Inuyama Castle 犬山城. Of course, pictures and descriptions to come. Also, since I'm being asked from a couple of quarters for information on the Kendo tournament in a non-Japanese form, I'll also write that. And, there's the last two days that my friend M was in Japan. But first, some linguisticy things.
In a recent post on Language Log, Bill Poser makes some interesting observations (some of which I'd thought about some before, though not in much detail) about cooking language. Now, (at least in English) the syntax of cooking instructions is interesting (e.g., object-dropping that you don't usually get), but that's not what Dr. Poser considers in his post. He mentions several words for (manners of) cooking in English (as opposed to other words for general cooking, like prepare or make, which is also an interesting cut of the language). There is a longer list in the Apply_heat frame that the folks at Framenet have cooked up (hahaha). He contrasts this with Carrier and Japanese. Familiar only with the latter language, I will limit my comments to Japanese.
Though Dr. Poser mentions (quoting) 煮る [niɾu] "boil, stew", 湯通る [judo:ɾu] "steam", 揚げる [ageɾu] "deep fry", and 焼く [jaku] which covers "fry, roast, bake, broil, toast", there are actually some others. Among them are 炒める [itameɾu] "stir fry" 炊く [taku] "to boil (rice)," 煮詰める [nitsumeɾu] "to boil down," ふかす [fukasu] "to steam," and あぶる [abuɾu] "to broil/grill." Also, I've never heard of 湯通る [judo:ɾu] "steam," though I do know of 茹でる [judeɾu] "boil." Now, of all that I added, I've only ever heard or seen the first three and 茹でる (but then, I don't read a lot of cooking manuals). And, you might argue about 煮詰める since it is a compound (boil+cram). Also, although he alludes to it, 焼く can be used to mean "cook," regardless the method (for instance, I believe you can use it to ask if something has been cooked if you aren't sure if how it might have been cooked).
In any case, this essentially amounts to nit-picking, but I thought there were some rather important non-obscure cooking verbs that went overlooked in Dr. Poser's post. One point I can mention is that I'm unsure what he means by "basic cooking terms." Now, I'm no master of cuisine (never having appeared on 料理の鉄人), but I think that boiling, steaming, deep-frying, and yaku-ing cover most of basic Japanese food. When you get to nearby Chinese and Korean food, the word 炒める starts coming up a lot. Perhaps I'm missing something, but I'm not sure what other cooking technique(s) are commonly used in Japan that are missing their own lexical item.
Finally, he notes a point that language educators I'm sure worry about (or at least, I hope they do) about the nature of the words that second-language learners acquire in the classroom. Namely, they don't acquire many of the words that native speakers might consider basic. For instance, I cannot remember learning the words 小枝 (twig/branch), 新芽 (sprout), or 炒める (fry) in the equivalent of four years of Japanese in a classroom (though of course I learned important things like 統一 (unification), 資本主義 (capitalism), and 二酸化炭素 (carbon dioxide). And the words that are many times the most basic and easiest to understand for native speakers of Japanese are completely lost on foreign students - namely, mimetic words. Now, of course the program in a classroom for students majoring in Japanese (or any language) is going to have certain goals, like perhaps preparing students for a job where they have to use Japanese, but that can't be true in all cases, or maybe even in the majority. But in any case, I don't really have anything new to say about this, just repeating sentiments that many people have had in the past.
[update (2004.06.21): Dr. Poser has slightly revised his post, noting that although たく has many non-cooking uses (among them, 'to heat,' as in with incense, charcoal, or a bath), it has taken a specialized meaning in the field of cooking. Also, he clarified what he meant for me by "[not having] many basic cooking terms," namely that while the Japanese lexicon covers all types of common cooking in tradititional (and otherwise) Japanese cuisine, it groups together several types of commonly-distinguished methods (like baking, roasting, etc.) that in English must be distinguished.]
Well, it's been a few days since I've written here. That's because I was on a class trip to Aichi Prefecture 愛知県 to visit a Toyota fatory and Exhibition Hall, see the Tokugawa Art Museum, and go to Inuyama Castle 犬山城. Of course, pictures and descriptions to come. Also, since I'm being asked from a couple of quarters for information on the Kendo tournament in a non-Japanese form, I'll also write that. And, there's the last two days that my friend M was in Japan. But first, some linguisticy things.
In a recent post on Language Log, Bill Poser makes some interesting observations (some of which I'd thought about some before, though not in much detail) about cooking language. Now, (at least in English) the syntax of cooking instructions is interesting (e.g., object-dropping that you don't usually get), but that's not what Dr. Poser considers in his post. He mentions several words for (manners of) cooking in English (as opposed to other words for general cooking, like prepare or make, which is also an interesting cut of the language). There is a longer list in the Apply_heat frame that the folks at Framenet have cooked up (hahaha). He contrasts this with Carrier and Japanese. Familiar only with the latter language, I will limit my comments to Japanese.
Though Dr. Poser mentions (quoting) 煮る [niɾu] "boil, stew", 湯通る [judo:ɾu] "steam", 揚げる [ageɾu] "deep fry", and 焼く [jaku] which covers "fry, roast, bake, broil, toast", there are actually some others. Among them are 炒める [itameɾu] "stir fry" 炊く [taku] "to boil (rice)," 煮詰める [nitsumeɾu] "to boil down," ふかす [fukasu] "to steam," and あぶる [abuɾu] "to broil/grill." Also, I've never heard of 湯通る [judo:ɾu] "steam," though I do know of 茹でる [judeɾu] "boil." Now, of all that I added, I've only ever heard or seen the first three and 茹でる (but then, I don't read a lot of cooking manuals). And, you might argue about 煮詰める since it is a compound (boil+cram). Also, although he alludes to it, 焼く can be used to mean "cook," regardless the method (for instance, I believe you can use it to ask if something has been cooked if you aren't sure if how it might have been cooked).
In any case, this essentially amounts to nit-picking, but I thought there were some rather important non-obscure cooking verbs that went overlooked in Dr. Poser's post. One point I can mention is that I'm unsure what he means by "basic cooking terms." Now, I'm no master of cuisine (never having appeared on 料理の鉄人), but I think that boiling, steaming, deep-frying, and yaku-ing cover most of basic Japanese food. When you get to nearby Chinese and Korean food, the word 炒める starts coming up a lot. Perhaps I'm missing something, but I'm not sure what other cooking technique(s) are commonly used in Japan that are missing their own lexical item.
Finally, he notes a point that language educators I'm sure worry about (or at least, I hope they do) about the nature of the words that second-language learners acquire in the classroom. Namely, they don't acquire many of the words that native speakers might consider basic. For instance, I cannot remember learning the words 小枝 (twig/branch), 新芽 (sprout), or 炒める (fry) in the equivalent of four years of Japanese in a classroom (though of course I learned important things like 統一 (unification), 資本主義 (capitalism), and 二酸化炭素 (carbon dioxide). And the words that are many times the most basic and easiest to understand for native speakers of Japanese are completely lost on foreign students - namely, mimetic words. Now, of course the program in a classroom for students majoring in Japanese (or any language) is going to have certain goals, like perhaps preparing students for a job where they have to use Japanese, but that can't be true in all cases, or maybe even in the majority. But in any case, I don't really have anything new to say about this, just repeating sentiments that many people have had in the past.
[update (2004.06.21): Dr. Poser has slightly revised his post, noting that although たく has many non-cooking uses (among them, 'to heat,' as in with incense, charcoal, or a bath), it has taken a specialized meaning in the field of cooking. Also, he clarified what he meant for me by "[not having] many basic cooking terms," namely that while the Japanese lexicon covers all types of common cooking in tradititional (and otherwise) Japanese cuisine, it groups together several types of commonly-distinguished methods (like baking, roasting, etc.) that in English must be distinguished.]
